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#1 Guest_omare_*

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Posted 13 October 2005 - 05:04 PM

What does London Zoo do with their tortoises in winter, hibernate or leave them for people to see all year round? Do all zoos hibernate their tortoises? Has anyone on this forum ever had or still have a tortoise/s that has never been hibernated? Has it suffered in any way or are there any advantages?

#2 Guest_amy_smith33_*

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Posted 13 October 2005 - 06:20 PM

London Zoo does hibernate its tortoises.
If not hibernated, tortoises get very large to quickly. Causing deformaties.

Amy

#3 Guest_Joanne666_*

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Posted 13 October 2005 - 08:17 PM

There are no advantages to constantly over-wintering healthy torts, but lots of disadvantages :-( go to www.tortoisetrust.org for further advice under 'articles'
Hope this helps

#4 Guest_Katrin4711_*

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Posted 14 October 2005 - 11:26 AM

Whipsnade Zoo lets their torts hibernate. I couldn't find them this year in early spring. Then I realised that there were still in their boxes.

Katrin

#5 Guest_simon_*

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Posted 17 October 2005 - 04:55 PM

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 17-10-05 AT 04:57 PM (GMT)]

London Zoo does hibernate its tortoises.
If not hibernated, tortoises get very large to quickly. Causing deformaties.

Amy



I'd like to know where Amy has got her information from regarding London Zoo hibernating their tortoises. I remember taking a group of children there a few years ago in the winter time and seeing tortoises on display, this was confirmed by a friend of mine. To find out for sure I telephoned London Zoo today and was put through to the tortoise department where I spoke to a very knowledgable man who told me that tortoises technically don't hibernate (his words), he said that London Zoo don't hibernate any of their tortoises and that they are on display all year round. They even come out when it's snowing to dig around and go back into their heated enclosure when they feel the need to. He said that there are no disadvantages to not hibernating tortoises and said that the zoos that choose to hibernate their tortoises do so for breeding purposes, as when a tortoise wakes up the first thing it wants to do is breed. I would happily take the word of a specialist from London Zoo Omare, I asked him about your question on this forum regarding hibernation and he said you are doing nothing wrong in not hibernating your tortoise. When I told him about the comments made on this forum regarding not hibernating a tortoise "will make it grow too quickly and have deformaties" his reply was, thats rubbish. If you want,your welcome to telephone him and speak to him directly and he will tell you the same as he has told me today. He said the only advantage to hibernation is the fact zoos are able to breed tortoises more easily. Hope this helps.

#6 Guest_omare_*

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Posted 17 October 2005 - 08:36 PM

Thanks Simon for looking into this for me, it's very much appreciated. I really didn't think allowing a tortoise to stay awake during the winter was such a big deal as mine looks so healthy and hasn't suffered for it. I did think Amys answer about tortoises growing too quickly and getting deformaties if they wern't hibernated sounded a bit over the top. London Zoo is somewhere where you can get really good information from as they have experts that look after the animals and so should know right from wrong. After all if it was such a big deal, London Zoo would be the first to say and do it. Thanks again I hope this puts an end to all the fuss thats made on this forum regarding hibernating tortoises.

#7 Guest_Joanne666_*

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Posted 17 October 2005 - 08:43 PM

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 17-10-05 AT 08:52 PM (GMT)]No, it doesnt put an end to 'all the fuss'.........perhaps if London Zoo took the time to look at the 30 year research that has gone into this, they might learn something, and serious lengthen the life span of torts in their care.
If people cant be arsed to hibernate their torts thats their choice.Your tort many not suffer being kept awake for one winter but repeated over-wintering does lead to accelerate growth, every mouthful they eat from Nov to March they wouldnt eat in the wild......shell deformaties happen in captivity, which is why wild caught torts have such smooth shells.

#8 Guest_simon_*

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Posted 17 October 2005 - 08:51 PM

No, it doesnt put an end to 'all the fuss'.........perhaps if London Zoo took the time to look at the 30 year research that has gone into this, they might learn something, and serious lengthen the life span of torts in their care.
As for the info being 'over the top', this has studied for nearly 30 years by the tortoise trust, feel free to e-mail them and tell them its a load of bollocks.


It never ceases to amaze me how nasty you are and now you've lowered yourself even more by swearing, well need I say more. Tell me, are you a breeder or a Vet or both because either way you certainly don't act like a lady.

#9 Guest_Joanne666_*

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Posted 17 October 2005 - 08:53 PM

I think your confusing me with someone who's bothered about your opinion.

#10 Guest_simon_*

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Posted 17 October 2005 - 08:56 PM

I think your confusing me with someone who's bothered about your opinion.


Your opinions won't count for much if your going to swear at people, still your editing didn't do much did it.

#11 Guest_lisa0307_*

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Posted 17 October 2005 - 09:04 PM


No, it doesnt put an end to 'all the fuss'.........perhaps if London Zoo took the time to look at the 30 year research that has gone into this, they might learn something, and serious lengthen the life span of torts in their care.
As for the info being 'over the top', this has studied for nearly 30 years by the tortoise trust, feel free to e-mail them and tell them its a load of bollocks.


It never ceases to amaze me how nasty you are and now you've lowered yourself even more by swearing, well need I say more. Tell me, are you a breeder or a Vet or both because either way you certainly don't act like a lady.


Wow, Blonde Sarah was right when she said you were nasty wasn't she joanne666, I now have to agree with the email I was sent telling me what the 666 stands for in your name, isn't it something to do with the devil?

#12 Guest_omare_*

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Posted 17 October 2005 - 09:13 PM


No, it doesnt put an end to 'all the fuss'.........perhaps if London Zoo took the time to look at the 30 year research that has gone into this, they might learn something, and serious lengthen the life span of torts in their care.
As for the info being 'over the top', this has studied for nearly 30 years by the tortoise trust, feel free to e-mail them and tell them its a load of bollocks.


It never ceases to amaze me how nasty you are and now you've lowered yourself even more by swearing, well need I say more. Tell me, are you a breeder or a Vet or both because either way you certainly don't act like a lady.


I bet if anyone else had sworn like that they would have been removed from the forum. Theres really no need for aggression Joanne, everyones entitled to have their views but you don't need to swear to get yours across, maybe Simon was right about there being too many fish wives. I think he deserves an apology don't you?

#13 Guest_nikki_*

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Posted 18 October 2005 - 09:33 AM

Most zoo's only have their torts for a relatively short time. I have yet to find a zoo which has kept any individual tortoise for more than ten years or so. They usually die prematurely from either mixing species or incorrect husbandry. Ask London Zoo how long they have had an individual for - not how long they have been keeping them for. They state that that they have taken tortoises from members of the public for many years - if so, where are they. Why not ask their opinions of say, the Tortoise Trust the worlds largest specialist association for tortoise care and see wht their replies are then. They may have kept tortoises for many years but very few zoos are familiar with the exact dietry needs of their animals which is why they live such shortened lives.

#14 Guest_simon_*

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Posted 18 October 2005 - 05:32 PM

Most zoo's only have their torts for a relatively short time. I have yet to find a zoo which has kept any individual tortoise for more than ten years or so. They usually die prematurely from either mixing species or incorrect husbandry. Ask London Zoo how long they have had an individual for - not how long they have been keeping them for. They state that that they have taken tortoises from members of the public for many years - if so, where are they. Why not ask their opinions of say, the Tortoise Trust the worlds largest specialist association for tortoise care and see wht their replies are then. They may have kept tortoises for many years but very few zoos are familiar with the exact dietry needs of their animals which is why they live such shortened lives.



Your deviating from Omares original question. She asked if London Zoo hibernated it's tortoises and the answer was a resounding NO. Having been sworn at by Lady Joanne666 that the Tortoise Trust have done research for thirty years doesn't alter the fact that London Zoo have been around for a mighty lot longer and if there were any problems with not hibernating tortoises then they would know. Why people on this forum have to be agressive and start swearing is beyond me.

#15 Guest_nikki_*

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Posted 18 October 2005 - 05:55 PM

What swearing was that then simong? I never saw any1

#16 Guest_marvellous_*

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Posted 20 October 2005 - 08:10 PM

A few months ago we was invited for a VIP visit to a local zoo to see behind the scenes of their tortoises.They had a lovely outdoor enclosure to roam at their own free will.Inside where they slept,there was no substrate just a concrete floor with heat lamps all lined up,not even at the correct distance from the floor.They had tortoises that are different sub-species and also had spur thigh with Hermanns.In the bedding area there was veg leaves that was wilted and the odd bit of newspaper.I asked why they had the species mixed and explained that they should be kept apart.There answer was they was building a new area for the torts.But during this time,the torts could easily have damaged each other.Male spur thigh torts ram the females when mating to make the female give in.They can and do cause considerable damage to Hermanns if mixed.We explained this and it got shrugged off.We questioned them regarding health,food etc and the woman listened to what we had to say.There is always room for improvement we was told.Lets see what has changed when we go back for another visit,but i can guarantee that the torts will still be mixed and the living conditions wouldnt have changed.

Marvellous

#17 Guest_omare_*

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Posted 20 October 2005 - 08:46 PM

A few months ago we was invited for a VIP visit to a local zoo to see behind the scenes of their tortoises.They had a lovely outdoor enclosure to roam at their own free will.Inside where they slept,there was no substrate just a concrete floor with heat lamps all lined up,not even at the correct distance from the floor.They had tortoises that are different sub-species and also had spur thigh with Hermanns.In the bedding area there was veg leaves that was wilted and the odd bit of newspaper.I asked why they had the species mixed and explained that they should be kept apart.There answer was they was building a new area for the torts.But during this time,the torts could easily have damaged each other.Male spur thigh torts ram the females when mating to make the female give in.They can and do cause considerable damage to Hermanns if mixed.We explained this and it got shrugged off.We questioned them regarding health,food etc and the woman listened to what we had to say.There is always room for improvement we was told.Lets see what has changed when we go back for another visit,but i can guarantee that the torts will still be mixed and the living conditions wouldnt have changed.

Marvellous


Thanks for the info Marvellous. I only asked about London Zoo because we were curious as to what they did,little did we know it would start a riot and end this way. To be honest I feel really guilty for posting the question in the first place having seen what fuss it has caused. I just wish things could be as they were and eveyone back on here where they belong.

#18 Guest_simon_*

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Posted 18 October 2005 - 05:59 PM



No, it doesnt put an end to 'all the fuss'.........perhaps if London Zoo took the time to look at the 30 year research that has gone into this, they might learn something, and serious lengthen the life span of torts in their care.
As for the info being 'over the top', this has studied for nearly 30 years by the tortoise trust, feel free to e-mail them and tell them its a load of bollocks.


It never ceases to amaze me how nasty you are and now you've lowered yourself even more by swearing, well need I say more. Tell me, are you a breeder or a Vet or both because either way you certainly don't act like a lady.


I bet if anyone else had sworn like that they would have been removed from the forum. Theres really no need for aggression Joanne, everyones entitled to have their views but you don't need to swear to get yours across, maybe Simon was right about there being too many fish wives. I think he deserves an apology don't you?



Read it properly Nikki, It says Bollocks. Then she tried desperately to edit it but it was too late, I had already replied to her filthy language.

#19 Guest_blondesarah_*

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Posted 18 October 2005 - 06:01 PM

lol lol lol

#20 Guest_nikki_*

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Posted 19 October 2005 - 10:55 PM

Bollocks? - is that all - thought it must have been the f word or ##### or twat or worse. Sorry you have led sucha asheltered life simon(
Just off to edit - ops to late




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