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Out come on Alfie


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#1 Guest_littledeedee_*

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Posted 20 October 2010 - 05:21 PM

Been to the tort specialised vet and news isnt great about the boy unfortunetley sad.gif

He is severly deformed mainly because lack of calcium, heat and UV. his spin isnt right, because of this flat shell and so because of the deformed shell his lil legs go out sad.gif

I am so sad to know that all these problems are because of me and thought i was caring for him.

He will never be normal BUT he ISNT in pain and if I continue to give him heat/uv and give him calcium on his food he will not deteriate more and will live a long ol life and hopefully get stronger back legs.

His shell is also fairly soft and so he will not hibernate again this year.

Not great news Im afraid for him BUT hope to do good for him now. Just goes to show that when people dont have a clue how to care for pets their health really does suffer.

poor lil sod.. but I have a very special lil tort with special needs sad.gif

D
x





#2 Guest_Hettie_*

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Posted 20 October 2010 - 07:05 PM


Awww Dee, that is sad. sad.gif

Thank goodness you found out now though. He isn't in pain, you did the best you could for him with the information you had at the time. You can spend from now on giving him the life he deserves. wub.gif

Any questions on how else you can help him just ask. People are happy to help.

Paula x



#3 Guest_miller07_*

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Posted 20 October 2010 - 08:00 PM

Sorry to hear that Dee at least he's not in pain. As Paula said you did the best you could for him with the information you had at the time, Information is a lot easier to get hold of now and your making great improvments =D he's a lucky tort to have someone that loves him so much x

#4 Guest_littledeedee_*

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Posted 20 October 2010 - 08:43 PM

thanks guys... I am so gutted for him sad.gif

Right, im confussed. The vet said I have to give him upto 32deg during the day and drop him to about 24 for the night. to do this i need a thermostat. can anyone recommend a good one?
would i have to adjust this from day to night?

also, How would this work with a megaray or have I wasted another 50 on a megaray seeing as its heat and UV combined? the light would be on all night then too no?

also mentioned a digital thermometer?!?! not sure what this will do.. I have a normal one.

sooooo confussed

#5 Guest_miller07_*

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Posted 20 October 2010 - 09:51 PM

QUOTE (littledeedee @ Oct 20 2010, 09:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
thanks guys... I am so gutted for him sad.gif

Right, im confussed. The vet said I have to give him upto 32deg during the day and drop him to about 24 for the night. to do this i need a thermostat. can anyone recommend a good one?
would i have to adjust this from day to night?

also, How would this work with a megaray or have I wasted another 50 on a megaray seeing as its heat and UV combined? the light would be on all night then too no?

also mentioned a digital thermometer?!?! not sure what this will do.. I have a normal one.

sooooo confussed


Hi Dee. Is this beacause of his condition? As i just switch my lights off after 12 hours and don't use any other heat during the night (at the moment anyway) as the lowest it has droped is 16.5.I do beleive that the combi bulbs can't be used with a thermo stat but you could still use this during the day and just get something else for heat at night. I'm sure someone can recommend you something.
I think it's just a case of the digital thermometers being more acurate than the dial ones. I got mine from ebay and it gives me highest and lowest temp readings which is good as I then know how cold it has got during the night.
Hope this is of some help to you x

#6 Guest_miller07_*

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Posted 20 October 2010 - 09:58 PM

one like this should be ok if you want one with the min max reading http://cgi.ebay.co.u...=item3ef7562b55 I'd wait for someone else to confirm though lol

#7 Guest_Ozric_*

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Posted 20 October 2010 - 10:22 PM

Hi there. This is a sad story but your tort can live a healthy and happy life with you and will see better days in the future. When you had the right information you acted to put things right and nobody can ask for more. The MegaRay is an excellent lamp and will provide good UVB and heat during the daytime. If you are keeping the tortoise inside your own home then it is very unlikely that you need any extra heat at night. The exception is when a tortoise is having antibiotics or other treatment when higher night time temperatures can help them to fight off illness.

Most of us have houses that don't go much below 15C at night even in winter and personally I think this is plenty. If you do decide to provide extra heat at night I would suggest a ceramic heat emitter on a thermostat. This uses only a very small amount of electricity and is very reliable. Don't leave your MegaRay on 24/7 because the tortoise needs lower temps at night and to rest in the dark too. Also the MegaRay must not be used with a thermostat.

Your vet is probably just being very cautious about this night time temperature. Before you invest in more equipment I suggest you keep an eye on what the night time temperatures in the house are and unless its going way under 15C my suggestion would be this is fine.

You might want to get a cheap timer for your MegaRay. If you get a ceramic heat emitter for nights then yhou will want a timer for that too.

A digital thermometer with a probe is a great thing to have and you can get them for about 8 or maybe less. Some of them have max and min measures which is good as it would show you how cold it got overnight.

Many tortoises with problems like this one have been re-homed and led a very contented life and there is no reason this one cannot do the same. Although some damage is permanent the tortoise of course doesn't know any of this.

Best wishes and I hope you stay with us! Ozric



#8 Guest_Lin_*

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 07:45 AM

I keep my torts in the spare bedroom with no heat in there enclosure at night and it seems to suit them fine

#9 Guest_littledeedee_*

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 08:48 AM

Hi,
thanks peeps for replies.

he is in my lounge and so he isnt cold cold... I will get a digital thermometer and check how low it goes of a night. if it drops too low then i will look to maybe buy another night bulb and get a thermastat for that one seeing as one cant be used with a mega ray.

at the moment, the normal thermastat shows around 20deg of a night but the vet said no lower than 24.. not sure if he is just being cautious or if its because he is "special".

with the mega ray, where should i be testing the heat to maintain the 34deg? i assume NOT directly under his basking area

D
x

#10 Guest_miller07_*

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 10:31 AM

QUOTE (littledeedee @ Oct 21 2010, 09:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Hi,
thanks peeps for replies.

he is in my lounge and so he isnt cold cold... I will get a digital thermometer and check how low it goes of a night. if it drops too low then i will look to maybe buy another night bulb and get a thermastat for that one seeing as one cant be used with a mega ray.

at the moment, the normal thermastat shows around 20deg of a night but the vet said no lower than 24.. not sure if he is just being cautious or if its because he is "special".

with the mega ray, where should i be testing the heat to maintain the 34deg? i assume NOT directly under his basking area

D
x


Yes I have the probe on my thermometer placed on the soil directly under her light. If it gets a bit too warm under there they can then move so they are not directly under the light wink.gif x

#11 Guest_littledeedee_*

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 12:06 PM

Great thanks.

I think he is all good to go now.
Right....he has a table, that he has sort of settled in,
Have fitted the digital thermometer.... with a prob and shows max/min (now showing at 31.4 degree) not direct under lamp but near.
He has a solar glo 125w light fitted which is UVB/UVA and heat in one go... I ordered him a megaray 2 weeks ago... bloody thing still not arrived and so they sending me a replacement... couldnt risk him so went and JUST bought the solar glo! (another 40)
he has a mini kennel.. that he seems to love. a hill to march up, some stones to climb, some bamboo to climb and hide and walk around.
I have bathed him (vet said for me to do daily... whilst preparing his food)
I have done this, put him back in his home.... feed him mixed leaves (mainly rocket and watercress) and kale and sprinkled some calcium powder the vet gave me.
I Have moved his stones and bamboo around.. (not sure if torts like change?!?) but keeps him intrested, i hope!
some cattlefish in there but he just tramples over it.
i did have some water in there but he just uses it as a puddle and storms over it to get to the other side, with all the soil, its black in 2 seconds!! so have taken out. As bathing him daily, hope this to be ok?


Alf watch....
so far, He has had a mini munch. Im glad as he hasnt eaten since been in the table...
He WAS contend under the lamp for a minute and now he is having a route around back to making a bloody racket!!

am hoping thats him all sorted now (anything ive missed?)

ooh, one last thing... when I bought him I got paper work. was told that the paper work was only good till he got a certain length and the need to be chipped. I got him chipped at the place i got him.. who are bloody rubbish, now I learn!!
They didnt tell me i needed to send his paper off to get new papers!! the vet told me this yesterday... grrrr!!
(** just spoke to EFRA and they said thats rubbish... im to keep the original cert with details of his chip on and IF i go to sell him then a new cert is issued... just goes to show the professionals dont even bloody know!! **) blink.gif


thanks for all your help and support guys... if i hadnt found you's, the boy would be still sleeping under me radiator and walking around the house and proberbly dead in a couple of years sad.gif

D & Alfster x

#12 Guest_miller07_*

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 01:54 PM

QUOTE (littledeedee @ Oct 21 2010, 01:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Great thanks.

I think he is all good to go now.
Right....he has a table, that he has sort of settled in,
Have fitted the digital thermometer.... with a prob and shows max/min (now showing at 31.4 degree) not direct under lamp but near.
He has a solar glo 125w light fitted which is UVB/UVA and heat in one go... I ordered him a megaray 2 weeks ago... bloody thing still not arrived and so they sending me a replacement... couldnt risk him so went and JUST bought the solar glo! (another 40)
he has a mini kennel.. that he seems to love. a hill to march up, some stones to climb, some bamboo to climb and hide and walk around.
I have bathed him (vet said for me to do daily... whilst preparing his food)
I have done this, put him back in his home.... feed him mixed leaves (mainly rocket and watercress) and kale here's a link with some other shop bought foods they can eat when you can't get hold of weeds http://www.tortoisetrust.org/enews/and sprinkled some calcium powder the vet gave me.
I Have moved his stones and bamboo around.. (not sure if torts like change?!?) but keeps him intrested, i hope! i have read that torts ain't the best with change although i think all torts are diff I keep mine as it is untill it clean out day (every 6ish weeks) then I have to remove everything anyway although she seems to like it as it is now so think I will put it back as it is next clean out. If he hasn't totally settled I would leave things just for now and maybe have a move around when you have to clean it all out next?
some cattlefish in there but he just tramples over it.
i did have some water in there but he just uses it as a puddle and storms over it to get to the other side, with all the soil, its black in 2 seconds!! so have taken out. As bathing him daily, hope this to be ok? not sure on this sure someone else can let you know. I do find putting pebbles aroung her water dish removes some dirt before she goes in there and I have pebbles in there as well( just a suggestion if you do need water in there)


Alf watch....
so far, He has had a mini munch. Im glad as he hasnt eaten since been in the table...
He WAS contend under the lamp for a minute and now he is having a route around back to making a bloody racket!!

am hoping thats him all sorted now (anything ive missed?)

ooh, one last thing... when I bought him I got paper work. was told that the paper work was only good till he got a certain length and the need to be chipped. I got him chipped at the place i got him.. who are bloody rubbish, now I learn!!
They didnt tell me i needed to send his paper off to get new papers!! the vet told me this yesterday... grrrr!!
(** just spoke to EFRA and they said thats rubbish... im to keep the original cert with details of his chip on and IF i go to sell him then a new cert is issued... just goes to show the professionals dont even bloody know!! **) blink.gif


thanks for all your help and support guys... if i hadnt found you's, the boy would be still sleeping under me radiator and walking around the house and proberbly dead in a couple of years sad.gif

D & Alfster x


Hope thats of some help....Sounds like your doing a great job with Alfie now biggrin.gif


#13 Guest_Hettie_*

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 05:10 PM

Well Dee, rolleyes.gif biggrin.gif, how very dare you!!! The Alfster worked hard making his water muddy... laugh.gif

Seriously though, yes he needs it putting back, he will need access to water at all times. As suggested already if you put some stones around his bowl it will dry out his feet a little before he gets to the mud... not alot but it all helps. rolleyes.gif

Did you put the bulb at one end of the table so that he has a cooler end to retreat to? I wonder if this is what the vet meant, that he will need a cooler end to thermoregulate his temperature?

Sounds like you have got everything covered. Have you read our edible weed section? A varied diet is really important to help keep Alf healthy.

Paula x



#14 Guest_littledeedee_*

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 05:31 PM

thanks Roxy's mum and Paula.

ill put his water back in... maybe ill get him a pair of flip flops!!

I have had a look at the link Roxy's mum sent and i pretty much do what it states and mix all the mixed leaves and herbs up, he loves his rocket. Im lucky (not) as i seen to grow a fair few weeds in my garden (bloody things, spend ya life trynna kill them and then notice the lil shelled blighters love them and so dont) so pop out and grab a handful each day for him. must say, he is showing off lately and apart from the small amount of kale earlier, hes off his food... unless i hand feed him. spoilt lil sod, am not doing that! so the weeds are just wilting and going to waste.

i think its all due to the changes he has had. must be hard work all that strutting up and over pepples and in for a bit of aqua aeorbics... playing xylophone on his bamboo.. maybe that will work up an appertite!!

the lamp is in the middle of his table but there is a cooler part for him although he is currently as i type catching some rays like he is in Sharm el Sheik!! so me thinks he is enjoying himself. Im sure he even smiled at me earlier. (gionna get right ump in a mo when I switch it off!)

D
x

#15 Guest_Hettie_*

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 07:49 PM

Hi Dee,
Just checking you know that some weeds are toxic or not suitable for the Alfster? Sounds like he is becoming a very pampered little tort!

Paula x


#16 Guest_miller07_*

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 07:49 PM

QUOTE (littledeedee @ Oct 21 2010, 06:31 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
thanks Roxy's mum and Paula.

ill put his water back in... maybe ill get him a pair of flip flops!!

I have had a look at the link Roxy's mum sent and i pretty much do what it states and mix all the mixed leaves and herbs up, he loves his rocket. Im lucky (not) as i seen to grow a fair few weeds in my garden (bloody things, spend ya life trynna kill them and then notice the lil shelled blighters love them and so dont) so pop out and grab a handful each day for him. must say, he is showing off lately and apart from the small amount of kale earlier, hes off his food... unless i hand feed him. spoilt lil sod, am not doing that! so the weeds are just wilting and going to waste.

i think its all due to the changes he has had. must be hard work all that strutting up and over pepples and in for a bit of aqua aeorbics... playing xylophone on his bamboo.. maybe that will work up an appertite!!

the lamp is in the middle of his table but there is a cooler part for him although he is currently as i type catching some rays like he is in Sharm el Sheik!! so me thinks he is enjoying himself. Im sure he even smiled at me earlier. (gionna get right ump in a mo when I switch it off!)

D
x


Sounds like your doing everything needed for wee alfie now wink.gif as for the not eating properly this could well be due to the change in his living arrangements, our wee friends can take a while to settle rolleyes.gif I think they just like to keep us on our toes wacko.gif x

#17 Guest_littledeedee_*

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Posted 21 October 2010 - 10:25 PM

Just checking you know that some weeds are toxic or not suitable for the Alfster? = thats a thought..... i cant tell a weed from a rose! but he likes and know dandilions are good, so aimed for them

Sounds like he is becoming a very pampered little tort! - NOT ANYMORE!! dry.gif thats got him in this situation!


(light and heat off and dropped to 24deg... what vet man said, so pleased with that)


quick question.... the boy sleeps with his head out... always has. He ssed to just find a corner and sleep, as longs as his nose touched something... anything, he was soundo. Now he is in the table, he randomly sleeps anywhere. I see it as he must feel safe in there. what do you's think, in comparisan to your torts?



#18 Guest_Hettie_*

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Posted 22 October 2010 - 08:34 PM


I couldn't possibly comment! LOL! Every time I am convinced my guys have found a permanant sleeping spot... they change! I must admit though they usually do find somewhere to hide, Boo is currently digging a trench under his slate. rolleyes.gif

Another weed you could try for at the moment is plantain, there is loads around here at the moment and it is an easy one to identify. See if its in our weed section otherwise you could try google images?

Christmas is coming, perhaps a wild flower book could be on the list! laugh.gif

Paula x

#19 Guest_littledeedee_*

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Posted 22 October 2010 - 08:47 PM


Christmas is coming, perhaps a wild flower book could be on the list! laugh.gif


and Brussel sprouts of course!!

D
x

#20 Guest_Ozric_*

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Posted 22 October 2010 - 10:04 PM

Dee it's so encouraging that you have made these changes which WILL benefit this tortoise! smile.gif

The water dish can be a bit annoying because they do trash everthing, get mud everywhere and make a mess. Try different ways of putting a little bowl out and maybe surround it with stones so that the soil doesn't always get dragged into the water. They DO drink from the water we put out for them but often they only do it when they think there is nobody around. Seriously! They are vulnerable to attack whilst drinking and take precautions.

Its fun and easy to learn weeds and some us here have built up quite a knowledge over time. I cultivate various kinds of weeds and flowers for the tortoises and find this very enjoyable. A lot of mine are in neat rows as though they were carrots. Get to know your clovers, plantains, sow thistles and vetches. Those ones are easy to learn.

Keep us updated on the progress of this special animal.
Ozric




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