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vivariums


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#21 Guest_lepinsky_*

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Posted 21 August 2005 - 08:28 PM

Just checking, but are you sure that the link in your message is the right one (www.tortoiseshop.com)? When I click on it I get something really odd with Japanese symbols, and the address turns into something called pornoupdate.com. Maybe something is wrong with my browser.

#22 Guest_Joanne666_*

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Posted 22 August 2005 - 07:51 AM

ROFL - I did that once, there are definately no torts on THAT site. If your having problems got to www.tortoises.net there are good pictures of enclosures on there too, and I promise its not a porn site :-)

#23 Guest_emma72_*

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Posted 22 August 2005 - 03:13 PM

oops :o just looked myself LMAO

i got mine from tortoise shop and i asure its not a porn site

sorry Emma

#24 Guest_arnhib_*

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Posted 18 September 2005 - 04:26 PM

Hello all
http://www.thetortoiseshop.com
Someone forgot THE :-)
Arnie

#25 Guest_Freddy_*

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Posted 02 October 2005 - 01:30 PM

could someone please post a pic of what you keep your torts in, we currently have our torts in a viv but if it is going to harm them i would rather change, id like a few ideas of what to now put them in

#26 Guest_Calamity Jane_*

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Posted 02 October 2005 - 04:08 PM

Hello,
Here is a pic of my table top enclosure its what my husband built.
The basic frame is a potting bench which we got from our local DIY then we built the sides up up skirting boards then added the lights.
Its filled whith 50/50 loam based compost & play sand. I made it quite deep so the tortoises can burrow down, Also Rocks & Shrubs, A shallow dish for water should be provided so they can take a bath & this Hydrates them.They will wade in & out & also encourages them to poo. So make sure you change the water regulary!
I give them Cuttlefish pieces too as they like to bite on this & it supplies them which calcium.
I got all the help and information from this website before I got George & Mildred. This site has been invaluable for me.
Hope this helps a little and if you like you can visit my website for more pics & Info.




Yours
Joanne
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www.tortoises.piczo.com

#27 Guest_arnhib_*

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Posted 02 October 2005 - 04:09 PM

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 02-10-05 AT 04:16 PM (GMT)]Here's a couple of ideas, One has newspaper but the best substrate is Auboise (hemp)
do you need any ideas for an outdoor enclosure for next Spring???
Arnie
P.S. I can't get the other one to upload but I see Joanne has put one on
for you

#28 Guest_Calamity Jane_*

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Posted 02 October 2005 - 04:23 PM

Yes thats right Auboise Hemp substrate is very good.
Thanks to Arnib I now use this in my outdoor enclosure as it keeps them nice and warm.





Yours
Joanne
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www.tortoises.piczo.com

#29 Guest_mic263_*

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Posted 02 October 2005 - 08:59 PM

please can someone tell me where i can buy Auboise from, thanks

#30 Guest_kategore_*

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Posted 03 October 2005 - 12:52 AM

You can get Aubiose from farm/horse shops. If you contact the company they'll tell you your nearest supplier. Their website is www.aubiose.co.uk

Kate

#31 Guest_ajs123_*

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 12:10 AM

Hi, I bought a hermanns tortoise complete with a vivarium set up, it lasted 6 weeks, poor thing died, I've got another one now, in a open top enclosure, and I've had 'Tiddles Too' for 11 months now. I strongly believe that vivariums DO KILL tortoises, that's from my own experience.
Hope this helps,
mand

#32 Guest_arnhib_*

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 08:51 PM

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 05-10-05 AT 08:53 PM (GMT)]Thank you Amanda for sharing this with us, I know how hard it must have been for you to tell us.
You telling of your experience may help other tortoise in the future, so his death won't have been in vain
Arnie

#33 Guest_zDocWho_*

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 12:49 AM

So far there has been a lot of heat and very little light shed on this rather important topic.

Do Viv's kill tortoises - the short answer is NO, the full answer is more complicated.

A vivarium per se is not bad for a tortoise, a poorly designed viv of course is bad for a tortoise. In any case a well designed and stocked viv can be better then a poorly designed and stocked table top and more than likely a well designed viv is about as good as a well designed table top layout.

It is probably easier however for the average person to create a decent and tortoise friendly table top layout than the same with a viv.

Additionally a vivarium can mean one of many different type of designs. Some people think than a vivarium must mean a closed glass fish tank (bad), others might take it to be a spacious glass fronted enclosure with good ventilation, equipment, temperature gradients, micro climates, substrates and with sensible stocking levels (good). Obviously these are 2 extremes with many shades and classes in between.

What makes a bad vivarium bad is IF there are high humidity levels (for arid torts), no temperature gradients, no access to micro climates and poor air circulation.

If you have a viv which addresses and overcomes these issues you have a GOOD tortoise setup and there should be no fundamental reasons why your torts would not be just as happy in this viv setup as in any other type of setup which addresses these important issues.

The point is there are GOOD vivariums and there are BAD vivariums.

#34 Guest_Joanne666_*

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 06:28 AM

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 06-10-05 AT 06:31 AM (GMT)]Generally when we refer to vivs to new tort owners, they are they tiny, glass fronted enclosed vivs that pet shops sell with torts.
I agree that, for new owners, its far easier to make a table top that is suitable and safe, rather than re-design the viv.
The basic and general design of a standard viv will harm a tort if its not pulled to pieces, most new owners prefer to take it back for a refund :-)
Surely a good viv is one thats been re-designed to resemble an open-top

#35 Guest_blondesarah_*

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 07:51 AM

i totally agree with you zDocWho

#36 Guest_nikki_*

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 09:26 AM

There is also the size issue and the accompanied stress. It's a bit like saying is it cruel to keep a goldfish in a bowl as opposed to a tank, or a dog in a kennel as opposed to a garden, or a pony in a stable rather than a paddock. The old old question of whether we are keeping animals merely as something to look at close hand rather than thinking of it's specific needs is often overlooked too. A human would probably not die for a long time if kept in one room with all food and cleaning requirements. It would be a pretty miserable existence though - yes? Call me extremist if you like but animals are not toys and should be catered for accordingly. I suppose this important issue will be considered more heat and not enough light again and I will be ranted at for being a common fish wife for putting views forward on behalf of the animals again. Sorry torts I tried :'(

#37 Guest_Joanne666_*

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 10:32 AM

The size issues bother me too Nicki, there never seems enough floor room, even if the viv is hacked to pieces to make it acceptable. Most new owners arent 'clued up' enough to know how to do this anyway and end up putting their torts is custom made vivs which are great for lizards and geckos. But normal vivs and hermanns torts, dont and shouldnt go together.

#38 Guest_zDocWho_*

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 11:59 AM

If one has to generalise : The safer and healthier route in general would be for the beginner tort keeper to go for the open table top layout.

I agree that most starter viv's as supplied to people who are just beginning their new hobby (passion?) are not suitable without modification.

We should try to explain in more detail to people asking about viv's so at least they understand why viv's often are unhealthy tort homes.

#39 Guest_nikki_*

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 01:31 PM

We should try to explain in more detail to people asking about viv's so at least they understand why viv's often are unhealthy tort homes.



You mean like this?
http://www.tortoiset...es/vivarium.htm

#40 Guest_Joanne666_*

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 02:21 PM

I give out the above Tortoise Trust link all the time, I dont expect anyone to just take my word for it.




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