Jump to content


- - - - -

Dwarf Hermanni?


  • Please log in to reply
31 replies to this topic

#21 Guest_Stellanne_*

Guest_Stellanne_*
  • Guests

Posted 06 February 2012 - 09:18 PM

This is an excellent read. I looked at it and ID'd peta etc. but to be fair it is good to have some expert opinions x x x hugs x x

#22 Guest_JEANETTE_*

Guest_JEANETTE_*
  • Guests

Posted 06 February 2012 - 10:48 PM

I think that this may help http://www.shelledwa...hread.php?t=243 I had bookmarked it to identify mine but forgot all about it until seeing this post! I always though mine was a TBH, but now I think that it may actually be a THHerc.


This was really interesting to read... does he belong to this website/forum? They still all look so similar to me.. and the bottegeri is sometimes described as "dull" well I shan't show Cola this, she's still getting over me calling her "common" ha ha x

#23 Guest_Freddy McGavin_*

Guest_Freddy McGavin_*
  • Guests

Posted 06 February 2012 - 11:17 PM

he!he!That's funny Jeanette! :lol: Poor Cola, Bless her :wub:
Kind Regards
Freddy :D

#24 Guest_Ozric_*

Guest_Ozric_*
  • Guests

Posted 07 February 2012 - 12:03 AM

Hi everyone. There are not a huge number of Hermanni Hermanni tortoises in the UK so mostly that won't be what we have if we got a 'Hermann' tortoise. On the A10 it says Hermanni meaning the species hermann. The certs always say that including when the tortoise is Hermanni Hercegoveninsis or Boetgerri and they don't record the sub species.

The Hermanni Hermanni tortoise is native to the south of France, parts of Italy and also found in the Baleraric Islands. The easiest place to see them is Mallorca although strangely the tortoises on those islands are not native but were introduced by humans at some point in the distant past.

If anyone thinks their tortoise might be hermanni hermanni then I could almost certainly say if they posted careful photos. I don't think Hermanni Chris has been on here. He has his own site http://www.gardensta...manniabout.html

I got a hermanni hermanni more or less by chance some years ago and decided just to keep that subspecies and I have quite a bunch of them now. Although I think they are lovely they are not hugely different to the other hermanns.

The photos on the thread pasted above from Shelled Warriors are fantastic. The tortoises that Chris used in his pictures are Italian Hermanni Hermanni and they are a bit different to the French and Balaeric Island ones. The Italian ones are more bright yellow and black colour and the French ones have more greeny browny colours on them. This tortoise looks different and is a different size in the various places we can find it.

In France there has been some inter-breeding in captivity between Boettgerri and Hermanni Hermanni tortoises. The tortoises that result are OK but they are neither one nor the other. This hasn't hapenned much in the UK because there are not all that many Hermanni Hermanni here.

Here is a photo of the underside of one of my Hermanni Hermanni. If you look carefully it is possible to see the lengths of the pectoral and femoral scute seams on this tortoise. Chris describes how to use that to identify the hermanni hermanni and it is the most reliable indicator. Most of the other signs like the yellow cheek patch can turn up on other hermanns.


Posted Image

#25 Guest_19Kel71_*

Guest_19Kel71_*
  • Guests

Posted 07 February 2012 - 07:35 AM

I need an expert opinion to decide which subspecies Norman is. I've posted a load of pics here:

http://www.hermann-t...l=&fromsearch=1

He seems to have a mixture of traits from all three species so it's hard to tell! Maybe he's a new hybrid!!! :lol:

#26 Guest_meimnot76_*

Guest_meimnot76_*
  • Guests

Posted 07 February 2012 - 08:29 AM

Yeah mine is a hybrid too....half tort half 4x4 ;)

Hey Jeanete there's no such thing as common tortoises ;)

#27 Guest_Freddy McGavin_*

Guest_Freddy McGavin_*
  • Guests

Posted 07 February 2012 - 03:18 PM

I need an expert opinion to decide which subspecies Norman is. I've posted a load of pics here:

http://www.hermann-t...l=&fromsearch=1

He seems to have a mixture of traits from all three species so it's hard to tell! Maybe he's a new hybrid!!! :lol:


Hi Kelly,
Hopefully Bruce will be on soon and can positively ID Norman for you. :) Take care. ;)
Kind Regards
Freddy :D

#28 Guest_Ozric_*

Guest_Ozric_*
  • Guests

Posted 07 February 2012 - 11:36 PM

I have had a look at Kelly's photos of Norman and indeed he does have the features of several hermann sub species!
There is every chance that Norman is a hybrid and I'm really not sure although he is a very nice specimen. In my reckoning he is not a Hermanni Hermanni or at least not a 'pure' one - in particular the femoral and pectoral scute seams are not the expected lengths. But he does have the yellow cheek patch of course, and is rather dark underneath although not uniformly. Its typical for the darkness underneath to be unbroken but not covering the entire plastron.

The colouration on the carapace is really very like a Hermanni Hermanni with a lot more colour than a typical boetgerri.

Bruce and Paula both have Hercegoveninsis hermanns so it would be interesting to see what they think. My guess is that Norman is a lovely mix.

#29 Guest_Hettie_*

Guest_Hettie_*
  • Guests

Posted 08 February 2012 - 07:33 PM

Sorry Kelly,
I am rubbish at IDing, I think I have it then I don't! :wacko:
It might help if you start a new post with pics asking for an ID as once read not everyone goes back to a post. :)

Paula x

#30 Guest_19Kel71_*

Guest_19Kel71_*
  • Guests

Posted 08 February 2012 - 09:51 PM

Bruce has had a look, and it appears he may be a herc as I suspected..... There's also a chance he could be a bit of a hermanni/hercegovinensis hybrid though because he's showing characteristics of both subspecies. :unsure:

So basically he's a mutt! LOL :lol:

#31 Guest_Freddy McGavin_*

Guest_Freddy McGavin_*
  • Guests

Posted 09 February 2012 - 11:35 AM

So basically he's a mutt! LOL :lol:


Although a very good looking mutt I would have to say Kelly! ;)
Kind Regards
Freddy :D

#32 Guest_Ozric_*

Guest_Ozric_*
  • Guests

Posted 09 February 2012 - 12:07 PM

I agree with Freddy - Norman is a lovely looking mutt!




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users