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Cat amongest the pigeons time


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#1 Guest_Andrea888_*

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Posted 23 October 2005 - 02:09 PM

For some time I have been looking at this forum and until now I have never felt the need to post anything. I have decided to post my feelings on this site due to the webmasters favouritism and bias towards two of the sites members and everyone will know who I am talking about. I really got into this forum when the subjects of worming,hibernation and zoos etc. May I point out that I'm a mother with two young daughters aged 5 and 7. I keep 7 Hermann Tortoises which are between the ages of 25 to 27. These are regularly checked by my local vet twice a year, he's an exotic specialist and they have always been the correct weight and size for their age and healthy. I'm sure to be attacked now but they have NEVER been hibernated nor wormed (the feaces are checked by my vet regularly). The past 27 years my tortoises have never needed to be wormed. They have all the proper requirements, their enclosure has the proper uv, they have their own room to return to. This has always worked for me. I also contacted London Zoo after all the fuss on this forum and although it's really good that the tortoise trust has done research
for the past thirty years, good for them, can I also point out that London Zoo has been around since 1846. They do what works best
for them,times change and so do veterinary procedures over the years. Years ago we were told to give our tortoises dog food but now we don't,we were told to always hibernate tortoises using straw as bedding. Years ago if a young child got a sore throst it was off to the hospital to have their tonsils removed, now we don't. Going back to hibernation ie. zoos do not always hibernate all reptiles that often hibernate for example, Diamond back Rattle snakes,Garter snakes and Terrapins. How many of us have gone to a zoo or a friends house to see Terrapins still swimming about when they hibernate in the wild,once they emerge from hibernation their body clock tells them to breed. I really don't understand when someone has a different opinion on this forum it seems to cause others to feel threatened and behave in a hostile manner. The word Forum in the dictionary says "a place to debate and discuss". My children normally look on this site but from now on I won't be allowing it as the web master of this froum allows swearing by individuals who are allowed to remain on the forum. May I also point out just because a person keeps one tortoise doesn't mean they will know less than a person that keeps ten. Tortoises to most people are pets, not just breeding machines. If you want to breed, fine thats your choice but I've chosen not to, there are no rights or wrongs. It's what works best for you. So come on webmaster stay neutral let everyone have their say and no favouritism.

#2 Guest_blondesarah_*

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Posted 23 October 2005 - 02:16 PM

well put i totally agree with you. I have a greek tortoise (7 years old) which i am winding down for hibernation but she is not liking it. It has been the end of the second week so far and as i am typing she is climbing and going mad because she is hungry. I have left the wind down period until now because she is so active. Now i am thinking should i wind her down? should i keep her awake because she is so active? what do other people think? Please if you have a nasty coment keep it to your self as Andrea has stated children are reading this. I really dont understand why certain people are still on this site

#3 Guest_omare_*

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Posted 23 October 2005 - 06:29 PM

well put i totally agree with you. I have a greek tortoise (7 years old) which i am winding down for hibernation but she is not liking it. It has been the end of the second week so far and as i am typing she is climbing and going mad because she is hungry. I have left the wind down period until now because she is so active. Now i am thinking should i wind her down? should i keep her awake because she is so active? what do other people think? Please if you have a nasty coment keep it to your self as Andrea has stated children are reading this. I really dont understand why certain people are still on this site


Sarah our older Hermanns tortoise is still very active as it's still warmer in London then it should be at this time of year. You can normally set your clock by her but the last two years have been very different as the winters have been getting colder alot slower. In past years she may have started winding down at the end of september but not anymore and to be honest I wouldn't force her to hibernate if she wasn't ready. She is still eating so we feel if she still feels hungry then why not feed her and let her wind down later and when she is ready, only she will know when the time is right. My friend who has an old tortoise has to send hers to her grans every year as she doesn't have anywhere cool enough to put her as she lives in a flat and so she is gonna have problems when her gran moves eventually, she may even stop hibernating her as she will not have a choice and she would never get rid of her. I wouldn't force a tortoise to wind down if they're not ready. Our younger ones will be awake all year and they love it. My Vet told me just the other day that if he had a pound for every tortoise he sees in the spring thats ill from hibernation he would be a richer man. He said he gets more sick tortoises that has resulted from hibernation than anything else.

#4 Guest_tortoise_mad_*

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Posted 23 October 2005 - 07:31 PM

Andrea888,

I am sorry that your family has not been able to use the forum due to bad language. Any type of bad language on this forum is not acceptable and any members that are found to be using such language will be removed.

You will see that i have over 800 members on the forum and over 6500 messages, so to police this is very difficult to do. This is why i rely on people like yourself to report all issue's too me.

At the bottom of each message you will see a link that says "ALERT", click this link on the message in question and i will get an email, i will then take the action necessary to keep this forum for the family. If i do find any bad language that has been reported the member's account will be removed without question. So please let me know about the messages so that i may deal with the offending members.


Regards


Webmaster

#5 Guest_blondesarah_*

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Posted 23 October 2005 - 08:54 PM

well thankyou webmaster, certain people have now been removed. Now we can all post without fear of getting a nasty message back. lets all get back to normal.

#6 Guest_tortoise_mad_*

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Posted 23 October 2005 - 09:13 PM

glad i could help, like you said lets get back to normal....

#7 Guest_omare_*

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Posted 23 October 2005 - 09:39 PM

glad i could help, like you said lets get back to normal....


Theres one person missing that should be hear mr webmaster,please make our day and do the right thing. Theres alot of people that would agree.

#8 Guest_tortoise_mad_*

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Posted 24 October 2005 - 08:54 AM

Omare,

If you are in contact with Simon, please let him know to contact me at hermann.tortoise@btinternet.com and i can discuss his membership to the forum.


Regards


Webmaster

#9 Guest_omare_*

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Posted 24 October 2005 - 06:01 PM

Omare,

If you are in contact with Simon, please let him know to contact me at hermann.tortoise@btinternet.com and i can discuss his membership to the forum.


Regards


Webmaster



All done mr webmaster, Simon was a great contributor on this forum, he certainly asked questions that made you think and discuss. thanks

#10 Guest_rupert_the_dog_*

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Posted 24 October 2005 - 08:24 PM

Well for what its worth....

This forum has not been the best place to chill and talk tortoise! Thats why we all came here in the first place, to talk tortoise. I will not comment on the departed but feel that a warning was more appropriate! This site has a habit of deleting to many people.

I can say this site may take a while to recover. It has been noted on other forums the wrangling that has gone on, in fact it has been called the Jerry Springer of forums on other tortoise forums!!!

Lets just hope that some of the people that have been put off by all of the fighting both novice and knowledgeble return and move on.

My 1st post was here and I was helped 100% lets hope other new owners can get the same feeling of help.

Regards

Mike

#11 Guest_Simon_*

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Posted 24 October 2005 - 08:27 PM

Well for what its worth....

This forum has not been the best place to chill and talk tortoise! Thats why we all came here in the first place, to talk tortoise. I will not comment on the departed but feel that a warning was more appropriate! This site has a habit of deleting to many people.

I can say this site may take a while to recover. It has been noted on other forums the wrangling that has gone on, in fact it has been called the Jerry Springer of forums on other tortoise forums!!!

Lets just hope that some of the people that have been put off by all of the fighting both novice and knowledgeble return and move on.

My 1st post was here and I was helped 100% lets hope other new owners can get the same feeling of help.

Regards

Mike



Amen!

#12 Guest_kategore_*

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Posted 24 October 2005 - 10:43 PM

Hi Andrea,

I'm a new tortoise owner and I will be hibernating mine but I'm interested in different people's ideas and experiences on the subject.
Where do you keep your torts in the winter? I can remember when I was young (donkey's years ago!) EVERYONE seemed to do the Blue Peter method every year - with mixed results :( - did people think you were unusual not hibernating yours?

Kate

#13 Guest_omare_*

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Posted 25 October 2005 - 08:50 PM

Hi Andrea,

I'm a new tortoise owner and I will be hibernating mine but I'm interested in different people's ideas and experiences on the subject.
Where do you keep your torts in the winter? I can remember when I was young (donkey's years ago!) EVERYONE seemed to do the Blue Peter method every year - with mixed results :( - did people think you were unusual not hibernating yours?

Kate



Whats the Blue Peter method Kate,sorry but I'm not originally from the UK. I don't hibernate my young Hermanns either, they're kept in an indoor enclosure with uv and heat and they have the run of the whole house, much to my dads dismay, when he comes to visit, the males are a bit vicious to say the least,but no one has ever thought it unusual apart from some who use to be on this forum. My vet doesn't have a problem with it either, he says more tortoises get ill from hibernation done badly then the ones that stay awake all year.

#14 Guest_arnhib_*

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Posted 25 October 2005 - 10:26 PM

Hello Omare
I was interested to see this, I suspect that the ill tortoises that the vet see's, is mainly due to bad preparation before the tortoise hibernates, waking up and moving, there for getting dehydrated and the wrong temperatures it should be kept at, so probably not hibernation, more the owners ignorance in the correct way of hibernation. And I don't mean that in any way nasty, years ago my tortoise died in hibernation, due to my ignorance
It's one of the scariest things hibernating the tortoise you care about, but the more we learn the safer it becomes for them.

My Vet told me just the other day that if he had a pound for every tortoise he sees in the spring thats ill from hibernation he would be a richer man. He said he gets more sick tortoises that has resulted from hibernation than anything else.

Arnie

#15 Guest_kategore_*

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Posted 25 October 2005 - 11:00 PM

Hi Omare,

You didn't have Blue Peter? Don't worry, you didn't miss much!
It's a kids' TV show with a number of pets. Every year when I was young they used to show us how they put their tortoise in a box of straw to hibernate for the winter. At the time everyone seemed to take it that this was the right thing to do which is why I wondered if anyone thought it was unusual that Andrea didn't hibernate her tort then. The show's still on but they seem to have different ideas on tortoise care now.

Here's a link so you can see their latest tort:

http://www.bbc.co.uk...s/shelley.shtml

BFN

Kate

#16 Guest_omare_*

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Posted 26 October 2005 - 06:03 PM

Hi Omare,

You didn't have Blue Peter? Don't worry, you didn't miss much!
It's a kids' TV show with a number of pets. Every year when I was young they used to show us how they put their tortoise in a box of straw to hibernate for the winter. At the time everyone seemed to take it that this was the right thing to do which is why I wondered if anyone thought it was unusual that Andrea didn't hibernate her tort then. The show's still on but they seem to have different ideas on tortoise care now.

Here's a link so you can see their latest tort:

http://www.bbc.co.uk...s/shelley.shtml

BFN

Kate



Thanks Kate, you see thats exactly what Andrea was saying about hibernation years ago, being told that using straw was ok but now things have changed,it does make you think though, how many tortoises may have suffered because of ignorance.

#17 Guest_omare_*

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Posted 26 October 2005 - 06:08 PM

Hello Omare
I was interested to see this, I suspect that the ill tortoises that the vet see's, is mainly due to bad preparation before the tortoise hibernates, waking up and moving, there for getting dehydrated and the wrong temperatures it should be kept at, so probably not hibernation, more the owners ignorance in the correct way of hibernation. And I don't mean that in any way nasty, years ago my tortoise died in hibernation, due to my ignorance
It's one of the scariest things hibernating the tortoise you care about, but the more we learn the safer it becomes for them.

My Vet told me just the other day that if he had a pound for every tortoise he sees in the spring thats ill from hibernation he would be a richer man. He said he gets more sick tortoises that has resulted from hibernation than anything else.

Arnie



Don't worry Arnie I know your not being nasty, I agree with you, there probably was alot of tortoise deaths due to ignorance. I know of at least one. My cousin had a very old tortoise many many years ago and they use to hibernate it in a box in the cellar. Then one summer I noticed it wasn't around, when I asked he said he had forgot all about it and it had died in the cellar. I'm no longer friendly with him as you can imagine.

#18 Guest_B E C K Y_*

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Posted 29 October 2005 - 12:07 PM

how could you possibly forget ur tortoise?!?!?!?!? he cant have been a true tortoise lover!

#19 Guest_omare_*

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Posted 29 October 2005 - 05:34 PM

No I guess not Becky. Thats why this forum is such an asset for everyone. As Andrea said, just because a person keeps one tortoise doesn't mean they will know less than a person that keeps ten. ;-)

#20 Guest_tyn7439_*

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Posted 03 November 2005 - 01:08 PM

I have just joined this forum and I have already found much of what has been said very helpful.I think I will stick to my guns and continue to overwinter my 5 year old,still extremely active,tortoise,who spends her winters running around my house eating expensive bags of moxed salads.Spoilt?nooooo.:(




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